Derrick Jackson, Toxic Christianity and how women can free themselves from the oppressive nature of other’s interpretation of your spiritual walk and your emotional wellbeing; Featuring Christian Counselor Dr Juanita Warrren of Chaplaincy Services & Consulting, Inc.

Toxic Christianity

Derrick Jackson, Toxic Christianity and how women can free themselves from the oppressive nature of other’s interpretation of your spiritual walk and your emotional wellbeing; Featuring Christian Counselor Dr Juanita Warrren of Chaplaincy Services & Consulting, Inc.

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Unknown Speaker 0:00
wonder what derek jackson and his wife spanish root word toxic christianity co franklin and james cleveland have in common i can tell you right now is this episode of the black therapist podcast starting right now

Unknown Speaker 0:16
hey guys

Unknown Speaker 0:18
um

Unknown Speaker 0:22
this week has been crazy have you not so i’m not gonna hold you a man to talk really long mostly because we have a really good show coming up and it’s a long one and i’m not going to edit it because i feel like i’ve missed some shows with you guys so i think i’m gonna just give it to you whole

Unknown Speaker 0:45
so

Unknown Speaker 0:46
next week we’ll have to come up with something else but i posted a guess it’s like got me my gif one miss nikki banks instagram page and if you’re not following me there as well as at black therapists podcast page shame on you but i posted a meme or gif or whatever i made a post and it basically talked about all of the pseudo psych colleges psychotherapists psychiatrists that were diagnosing derek jackson and his wife and now if you guys don’t know who derek jackson is that probably means that you’re well adjusted and that you read a lot of books but for those of you who don’t know he is a relationship expert if you were watching me you’d see i’m doing it in air quotes

Unknown Speaker 1:46
who basically the relationship on the best of his relationship only i’m gonna make myself at it myself

Unknown Speaker 1:57
best of his relationship on air and so there were a lot of different things happening he has miss represented himself in terms of his brand as this this guy he had this whole thing that said like black men don’t cheat and etc and i had been following him for a number of years i did not know he was married apparently that was part of his his his game and so i made a post about derek jackson and then people were asking me to like do this podcast this week so that was how this this came about but i want it to be respectful a lot of the vitriol and like bad stuff was directed at his wife who knows sis look like she’s probably going through spanx which happens when you have been with somebody for 14 years and he’s been hiring you on social media and not really telling too many people about you and then you find out that he’s cheating and sleeping with other people and you know possibly getting people pregnant allegedly you know she she looked like i would imagine she feels on the outside in so you know there was this post of him holding our hand some people refer to it as hostage video some people said that she had low self esteem some people well let me back that up some people did say she had low self esteem however if you go to her social media pages there were a number of polls that were alarming to me as a therapist if i take everything at face value every single thing that we seeing on social media is not facts everything that we post is not you know in alignment with what we’re feeling in the moment but if i only take everything that i’ve seen at face value from the perspective of therapists yeah there were a few things that were not sticking out to me one of my professors in college she used to she used to use a term whenever we were looking at like diagnostic indicators as red flags are there any red flags there were several red flags that were rave waving and some of them were like you know three storeys high but i don’t know her so to diagnose her was not something that i wanted to do i don’t know him to diagnose him is nothing that i wanted to do a lot of clinical terms are being thrown around like narcissist excetera and i mean i know what it’s like to love a narcissist my dad isn’t as a narcissist when i say that he meets a diagnostic criteria i don’t know if this man meets the diagnostic criteria but you know my spidey senses are tingling on a few things

Unknown Speaker 4:33
with both him and her

Unknown Speaker 4:35
um there were several posts that she put up about stalking other women who were interested in him and something about like a cultic church so i felt like the best way to respectfully approach this topic was to talk about it from the aspect of toxic christianity there was a post that she put up about battling demons to end being dressed for spiritual for spiritual warfare she had on like a hat and a army fatigue thing i get back if i only take it at face value with my history of growing up in a church she sounds a little intense but you know these these are not things that i haven’t heard before growing up in you know baptist christian church however i think that it was kind of alarming the way that people saw it because if you see him in the way he is on social media it’s very he has a very crafted image that said that’s what we’re going to talk about today and i have my friend who is christian counselor juanito warren to come on the show dr juanita warren also i just want to make a quick announcement one of my friends and somebody has been on the show before shout out to roxanne maskel if you haven’t checked out the episode that she and i did please do so her husband is doing a virtual play called the triggered life at the portland playhouse portland playhouse in the triggered project presents triggered life a requiem for healing written by john allah walay attico jay you should have known i wasn’t gonna mess that up keith sheets testimonies written by keith maskel and john allah walay i’m sorry i’m gonna screw up the last name blame it on a slave master the place called the triggered life is a multi sensory multimedia post traumatic story how exactly does sexual trauma cast a shadow over the wholeness of black male selfhood with the shared cultural values of black and brown communities and man that men suppress their vulnerabilities and meet with their psychology alone triggered life follows a day in the life of two such men a smell and key as these men relive their stories of abusive childhoods they embark on a journey to define their own manhood and identity the trigger life experience is a 90 minute tour de force followed by talkback facilitated by mental health conditions streamed live from the playhouse stage the play is going on from march 18 through april 4 tickets are five to $20 per household and there are some black and brown affinity performances coming up on march 31 and april 2 those are the remaining shows that are laughing you can go and get your tickets on portland playhouse.org and you can hit keith up and let him know that we sent you at keith maskel with two l’s on instagram and they also have a podcast is called living a trigger life podcast okay so check out my my people’s tell him that we sent you and so that’s what we have going on i just want to support them hopefully i’ll be able to get a ticket and attend this week but the way COVID mental health is set up this is tired i just want to also acknowledge the shootings that have taken place in the united states over the last few weeks and you know the sad piece about everything that’s happened is knowing that white people also perished in those attacks you know the obvious to me that the incident that happened in atlanta was a hate crime right because he looked for asian massage parlors the like you know how many white owned spas there has to be in atlanta area that if this was not a racial attack and a white guy with a gun who had a bad day wasn’t a thing that these people would have been safe they will be alive right but you know the the sad part about it for me was just having this thought that because eight people were shot in the incident that happened in atlanta yet two of them were white and you know the countless number i think it was 10 people that were killed in colorado which apparently colorado and white men and guns i know that this the perpetrator in the incident that happened in colorado i don’t want to say he has he had a middle eastern name right because i don’t want to want to

Unknown Speaker 9:12
link this to any kind of particular religion he had a middle eastern name but when you when you saw him coming out on the news and the way his skin presented you thought he probably was white right but when that incident happened a police officers were killed white people were shot so very young people seven children don’t have a father as and you know like the countless number of people who lost family members sisters brothers fathers mothers just going to buy groceries nobody screamed white lives matter nobody i didn’t see any hashtags that said blue lives matter

Unknown Speaker 9:50
non

Unknown Speaker 9:52
white supremacists were really silent on that

Unknown Speaker 9:59
we need to stop

Unknown Speaker 10:00
Hey, we need to stop making it the responsibility of the oppressed person, the one that is hurt, and castigated and thrown aside and damaged by white supremacy, we need to stop branding it with them, right? Stop. What is it a AAPI? Hate? Stop Asian hate. Let’s just start white supremacy. And we don’t need the black hashtag. We don’t need a Hispanic hashtag. We don’t need Asian hashtag. Let’s just gather white people together and get them in line. And let’s get some gun control. How about that. So I just want to make sure that everybody understands that if you are Asian, and you listen to this podcast that we support you, and the NSW New York State has really been doing programming. I know that NSW period has been doing programming to help to address the unique issues that people who are of Asian descent face. And so I just want you guys to know that we also stand with you, I don’t want it to seem that we have been silent. I’ve just kind of been still in a lot of different ways, because I’ve had to learn to conserve my energy. When we are definitely under energetic attack in this country. I agree with Derek Jackson’s wife on one thing, this is definitely spiritual warfare and you have to gear up, but just not in the way that she’s talking. Not in the way that she’s thinking.

Unknown Speaker 11:29
Okay, let’s just love one another. Let’s get into this episode. Introduce yourself to our listeners.

Unknown Speaker 11:35
I am Dr. Juanito. Warren, PhD in Christian counseling board certified Christian counselor, and therapist. Okay.

Unknown Speaker 11:46
So why did you think that it was important for you to actually be trained in counseling as opposed to like a lot of ministers do therapy, and they don’t really have like the clinical piece,

Unknown Speaker 12:00
primarily because I appreciate the the biblical foundation behind such but I also appreciate the science. And actually, I think Biblically, the Bible points to science as well. So I feel it’s just important to help me to be well rounded. Because I can address things with people and never have to bring the Bible into it or Jesus or Christ or religion into it. And they can understand the science behind it better than they can understand that the church or religion behind it is

Unknown Speaker 12:33
and what do you practice?

Unknown Speaker 12:35
What don’t practice speaking to the whole person, addressing the whole person, so I do a lot with financial therapy, and understanding that the person that behaviors behind are handling our finances as a financial coach and financial therapists, and financial counsellor, and then a lot of just individual and couples therapy, just to help people understand where they are in get to a better place and defining what better looks like for them. And how to reach there. Okay,

Unknown Speaker 13:07
and where are you located?

Unknown Speaker 13:08
Atlanta, Georgia? hotlanta.

Unknown Speaker 13:11
Why did I think you were in North Carolina?

Unknown Speaker 13:14
Because, because I was okay, cuz

Unknown Speaker 13:17
I’m like, wait a minute. Did I make this up?

Unknown Speaker 13:20
No, you did not. I was in I’ve gone back and forth between Fort Bragg in here for a couple of years. Okay.

Unknown Speaker 13:27
So you relocated to Atlanta? How many years ago?

Unknown Speaker 13:32
So I’ve been here. So I came back in 2014. And then I’ve been here for good since 2018. My

Unknown Speaker 13:43
gosh, we’ve known each other for a long time.

Unknown Speaker 13:46
We have probably since 20. leaks 2012 2013.

Unknown Speaker 13:52
And I’m, I don’t know, do you remember that time I reached out to you when I was really kind of struggling with my faith? Like if therapy was good for me if I could really do this. I don’t know if I was in school? Or if I was just finishing up what you told me.

Unknown Speaker 14:13
I remember talking to you while in the midst of thing but no, what did I tell you?

Unknown Speaker 14:19
Um, I think I kind of was just dealing with imposter syndrome at the time. And I was just like, I don’t know if I’m gonna even be able to do this. And I’m, I think you told me, oh, gosh, God doesn’t call the qualified, he qualifies the chosen.

Unknown Speaker 14:39
So it’s funny you say that because I was getting chills as you were telling the story. And for me, that’s just kind of how God speaks to me and not that it’s really cold in here. Because Yeah, that that was not the guy. And I usually

Unknown Speaker 14:50
screw that up. Like I usually screw that up and I was like, Oh my gosh, that’s so profound. And then I was doing something to share it with the client. and then i saw it was in the bible and i was like okay well there it is

Unknown Speaker 15:06
i think regardless of faith and belief there’s a bit of bible at all but

Unknown Speaker 15:10
yeah so i am not a christian counselor but i am a christian and so i find that a lot of my clients i’m using christianity with them i’m not so much in that i a lot of my clients are either spiritual or religious although i do find a lot of my clients now we’re in atlanta after the pandemic because i’m licensed in several different states and so you know just the basis of just kind of being a counselor or a therapist in the bible belt you just see a lot of you know christians and so i feel like it guides my practice but i am one of those christians now who i’m really not so into church i really want to get back into my bible i really want to invest a lot more into my own spirituality but i’m very cognizant of what a yama call is churchianity and this book this this kind of church as an oppressive tool and that’s kind of like what i wanted to talk to you about today and i was like i don’t really want to jump into this whole derrick jackson situation without looking at the christianity piece of it because i’m not so interested in the man who cheats and lies that’s like not breaking news right or somebody that misrepresents themselves as one thing and you know lives a different life right especially after this this last week i don’t know if you’ve seen or read the genius on that deal

Unknown Speaker 17:01
yes i

Unknown Speaker 17:01
have okay so i’ve you know and i have like a little aretha franklin story so i’ve never like been an aretha franklin fan just because generational we just kind of different only songs i really know that she did that like my arrow was jumped to it and you know a rose right but

Unknown Speaker 17:21
and pink cadillac

Unknown Speaker 17:23
oh yeah yeah

Unknown Speaker 17:24
okay well yeah those are the only songs i really really knew and obviously like the big ones respect and think because you know saw blues brothers and stuff like that but um my friend and i went to a broadway show and we i don’t know how we ended up either on the first or second row but we were like sitting off to the side and it was shows about the start and then they stopped everything and i don’t know didn’t know why it was like a little commotion and nothing aretha franklin come in and she was like sitting a row behind us and i was like this is strange i think my mother would probably care about this but like i wasn’t like it’s just that like interested my son was so young he didn’t know what like to care but like that was like a big deal for me like kind of watching her story this weekend because she’s been through so much but just looking at how her experience in the church growing up as a preacher’s daughter being pregnant you know two times before she was 14 i’m a father who obviously made less than a child it was a philanderer and was you know into drugs and alcohol and all these other things i had already heard of the stories of ceo franklin just kind of watching you know rachel’s his documentaries and some other things they talked about how you know people think that rock and roll was bad but church folk were the ones that were really kind of getting it in it kind of made me look at the landscape of what christianity is now and how it really is like a mechanism of control for a lot of black women and i’ll be missing it with my friends i feel like a lot of my friends have gotten to an age friends and family and i don’t know if anybody else can kind of relate to this where like they’ve been hurt so many times from from love and from the world and from everybody else and they get to a point where jesus is their boyfriend

Unknown Speaker 19:30
and so i think that goes back to being churchianity and that christianity because so much of it is not not biblically sound or biblically grounded yes it may be a bible verse but it so much is taken out of context like even the even the four walls aspect of church as we see it is not biblical like if you look at jesus christ and christians was it was it was a slander word like That’s what they called folks picking on those that follow Jesus like, Oh, you Christian, in terms of being like Christ, but none of that looks like Christ ministry in Christ ministered for like three years. But you see you have people in the pulpit for 30.

Unknown Speaker 20:16
anywhere?

Unknown Speaker 20:17
Yes, yes,

Unknown Speaker 20:18
any minister anywhere

Unknown Speaker 20:20
that have the wall, every have a marketing ministry or marketing budget, he didn’t have a salary the congregation wouldn’t pay and all that so much of what we look like is it the generations. None of what we call church today looks like church in the Bible. And in the Bible, we churches, us, we are called to be the church. It’s not it’s not a building, it’s who we are. And you look like Christianity much like Judaism or Muslim, or Islam. Like it’s a way of life. And but we’ve missed so much of that. And so many of us have experienced church hurt inside the four walls of church and by the humans. That the beings that are in there that don’t look a mirror Christ at all. So yeah, you listen church folk, or worse folk, in so many areas and aspects. So I’m with you in terms of churches, and what I do churches who I am, and that’s one of that’s been one of the blessings of what the world has called the pandemic. But what a lot of people of faith they do as a divine shut in. Yeah, in terms of it’s caused me to be to want to be more and more like the church and be more, be more of the church instead of focusing on that building that we go into, and where we can do the role and ritual. Anytime. Instead of doing what we do. So I think that’s kind of where we’ve gotten caught up. Is, is in the playing church, as opposed to being in a church.

Unknown Speaker 21:55
Yeah. Yeah. Um, and so, you know, even my aunts and my, my sister, my older sister goes to church at the same, you know, big mega church in DC. And yeah, problems, I’ll have conversation with my aunt. And she’d be like, you got to get into church, you got to get in the church. And I’m like, Well, you know, my experience in the church, I grew up in a church where my minister molested his niece, at 12. And though, of course, we would just talk in shows that she was fast, we didn’t know that it was him that he had done it. I mean, we didn’t find out until he was an adult until I was an adult, that he was the one that had gotten her pregnant. His his, his sister’s granddaughter, um, you know, there was sleeping around happening in my church, my minister was, you know, sleeping with a family member. And I knew all of this as a child. There was rumors, I guess, because his wife was West Indian, that she was practicing,

Unknown Speaker 22:56
you know, obeah.

Unknown Speaker 22:58
So it was just like, so like, for me as an adult. Now, trying to make sense of what my mind made sense of as a child. I’m going into that church, I don’t know how to function. In a church like I don’t I have very little trust in terms of like, what man tells me the Word says, so I have to read my own Bible.

Unknown Speaker 23:23
And look at that, too, is biblical. It says, study to show thyself approved. It’s the reason why they didn’t want us learning how to read. Because if we could read we would understand that whatever they were telling us, was a Christian or biblical about slavery, what and what was in the word, that’s why they didn’t want us to read that’s why they don’t want poor people do. That’s why literacy in pushed amongst poor, poor communities or poor socio economic statuses. Because they don’t want you to be able to read for yourself, but it says, study to show thyself approved and not just read but fully study, understand the context, understand the translation, understand what was going on and happening and what makes this relevant now and understand, you know why it’s relevant today. But they’re there in a church position, be it pastor, Bishop, chaplain, Deacon trust, the Usher, simple member, that a male Black or White has not tried to holler at me or initiate an inappropriate relationship with me, within the church household. Not a one.

Unknown Speaker 24:22
I’m not surprised that that. I’ll be looking back on one, you know, the situation with my minister, I know exactly who he is, or who he was, you know, he passed away not that long ago. And there was a time that I went back to the church as an adult, I laugh, but it’s not. It’s not funny. Um, my mother was very upset. But my grandmother died when I was six, and he was my grandmother’s minister. And there was some things that had happened within the family afterwards that involved him, but he did. up, I’m having my grandmother’s Bible. And he’s displayed it in the church. And I’m not really sure why. And it is one Sunday. My mother and I were having a conversation one week, and we were having a conversation. And she told me that he had my grandmother’s Bible, and that it was my Bible. And I was like, I don’t want him with my Bible. My grandmother died. When I was six, I didn’t have anything that she gave me. She put my name in it, it was mine, I was going to get it. And she was like, don’t go into church to go and get it. And I’m going to that church on Sunday. Because I know they’re gonna be there. And I’m going to get it. And I swear, I showed up in that church, like, I was going to fight. You know, growing up in the church, we did, we had the West guards, we, you know,

Unknown Speaker 25:49
not biblical

Unknown Speaker 25:50
breast, everything. So I went, I just woke up on a Sunday, when my jeans and sneakers on I was going to the church to get my Bible. And so I showed up, uh, when I got there, you know, he, he saw me come in. And there was some other things that I had wanted to address with him. Now as a grown up, that I could actually, you know, confront him about some things that had happened. And so his wife was very happy to see me she, you know, she always was, um, and she was very cordial. And then I was like, Yeah, I need to speak to pastor, he took me in the room, and I told him everything that I wanted to tell him and I was like, I am here for my grandmother’s Bible

Unknown Speaker 26:39
for you.

Unknown Speaker 26:40
And he looked at me like, well, that it was given to me. And I said, it has my name in it. And I didn’t give it to you. And I don’t care who gave it to you. But I’m here for my Bible. And so, you know, there were certain things that were said, they definitely weren’t apologies, he didn’t really like they weren’t offenses that were done to me. But there were things that I had seen that had happened around me as a child. And as a grown up, I was able to like articulate very clearly what I knew to be true. And so, all he could say to me was that, um, you know, you never been stupid. He didn’t apologize. He, he didn’t acknowledge he just say you never been stupid. And I spoke as Frank as I possibly could and use as much French as I know. And he was like, why you like you are in you’re disrespecting the church home. And I said, God doesn’t live here. Because if he did, you would not be who you are. And who he still was, because he had had children with his, his wife’s niece, allegedly grown and this person was grown. But like, this, this is kind of was their dynamic. And not just I was so disgusted that as a child, this is how Christianity was introduced to me, is still to this day breaks my heart. Because I know, my family went there for healing now, and I know that the damage that he did, but the damage that he could have done, had he been able to run a full MK inside my family. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Because he was my he was my grandmother’s minister. And so he was our link, our link to my grandmother who was our pillar. Yeah. And she passed away and it shattered our family.

Unknown Speaker 28:46
Yeah, I’m so sorry. But I definitely commend you on getting your Bible and taken back your grandmother’s Bible, and the courage that that took, because that fear is misplaced in us in terms of questioning adults and authority figures and religious figures. And doing what’s right as opposed to what is religious. So yeah, I would imagine your mama was mad, but she she she had to know her daughter and who she rather than it, telling you, you wouldn’t just want to sit on it. Um,

Unknown Speaker 29:24
I think she was kind of embarrassed a little bit. She really didn’t say anything. I think she knows that. I’m my father’s child as well. My dad would show up and show out. But, you know, I didn’t make a scene inside the sanctuary. I didn’t like we had our conversation in his office. I said what I needed to say I came at the end of set, you know, into service. Um, but I had him I needed him to know that I knew that this was not of God. Yeah. How you how you lived what you did how you what you preached, it was not of Christ, not in it not in this building. Yeah. And I literally saw that church be built. Like when it was a, it was a garage from like walls and like I literally thought I’d been built. Um, so yeah, he he, he devastated my family just by being the kind of person that he was. And I had no idea what happened after we left, but I was grateful when we did get out of that church. And that we were actually able to get away from there. Because like, my, my great aunts went there. And, you know, that’s how I ended up finding out that he passed away recently, because my grandmother sister told me, because she still went to that church until she left New York. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 31:01
felt the family church family, it was home.

Unknown Speaker 31:07
It felt like a prison to me,

Unknown Speaker 31:10
as many folks natural homes still. Yeah, not a safe place. Oh, good, good, good for leaving that. I’m glad your family got away. And I pray that anybody that hears your testimony in that, that it gives them the courage to do the same, to walk away from places that you know, aren’t right. Because your your, your Spirit tells you. The Holy Ghost speaks to us and will move you said, something’s not right about this. Maybe you can’t put your finger on it. But something’s not right about this, this place this person. Something’s not right. But in true church fashion, just like historically, it’s always been the women that showed it to blame. Like that’s from the Garden of Eden. Like, it’s always been the women like you mentioned that the young girl that was molested, and raped by anyone, by church folks, and pastors and men and leadership, it’s always the girl that fast. It’s always blamed on the female. But but that’s been since biblical times that make it right. But we always show the blame. And since we do shoulder the blame, that we got to shoulder the responsibility from, from the responsibility for getting from out of under that, and the responsibility for holding whoever accountable, accountable.

Unknown Speaker 32:29
And it breaks my heart as a grown woman to know that she was paraded and be rated in church every single Sunday. I had to sit there and listen to the man who did that to her every single Sunday, as her belly grew, and as you know, like that, just as a grown up now. I don’t know how you reconcile that. And I know that she was troubled. And that she had she, you know, had gone through things after that. But we were isolated.

Unknown Speaker 33:09
Every system that should have protected her did not

Unknown Speaker 33:11
but we were isolated from her because she was fast. So even people who could have actually gave her refuge and she was the same age as my oldest sister around her age. So my mother was definitely like, you got to stay away from that girl. She was shunned, but nobody said she’s, she’s like, 12 1314 Yeah. Um, and as I was watching, you know, even with that history, as I was watching Aretha, you know, there are rumors that her oldest son was her father’s. Yep. And I was like, it never even dawned on me that he could have even though I know that he had a child as well. It wasn’t so like, last night when I was thinking, like, and then I found out that the oldest son was also disabled, which sometimes happens and sets families. I was like, well, dang, this woman left him with these girls letter with these girls. And I saw my minister in the school that I taught at one day, and I let them know I don’t know whose child he’s coming to pick up but he’s he’s not safe for the children here. So I don’t know whose kid he’s coming here to to get but yeah, better. Yeah, to figure that out.

Unknown Speaker 34:42
Um,

Unknown Speaker 34:44
so yeah, just kind of thinking of like, you know, the shame that Aretha musta had to go through to go to church even even if he was not the dead, just being 12 and 14, and you know, fornication. And then you’re in church and your bodies grow in church fold. whisperin there has to be crazy.

Unknown Speaker 35:06
Oh, absolutely. And we as girls developing girls are shamed for our bodies developing, while boys are encouraged, for lack of a better phrase to saw their Royal Oak. You know, there they should be proud of their maturation while we should be embarrassed and ashamed of ours, from you know, wearing training bra so that I bosoms don’t appear to be so big and you know, other things that we can’t control that this is this is us, it’s not us happening to it. It’s happening to us. So yeah, we’ve just kind of as a as a community and a society, we’ve got to do a better job at protecting our young and allowing them to enjoy the innocence of youth longer than shorter, and not over sexualizing them.

Unknown Speaker 35:58
But what of what when we are not so young, I in a question group on Facebook, and I have to be honest, the things that I read in that group are alarming to me. There is always a battle for right or the souls of our people every single day in that group, and I’m like, when do you have time to just be um, there was an uproar about some teacher teaching our children yoga. And they were like, this is not of the Bible. They have them chanting the chances of prayer. Somebody had my sister had a Buddha in her house. And I’m like, the Bible says Be still and No. Bible says meditate on the word. Hmm.

Unknown Speaker 36:59
Matt Matta Tate book.

Unknown Speaker 37:02
But that’s not what but that’s not what they said that the Bible said. That that’s not what the Bible meant. But well until you can translate. What is the ancient and ancient our American could tell me what it says? word for words, as

Unknown Speaker 37:19
you since you,

Unknown Speaker 37:20
you know, you’ll, you know, biblical text. And you have translated it and you can translate it to modern English. And you told me But until then, I’m going to take this and then they got mad at me for pointing out that it is said that King James of the King James Bible, had a wife. And

Unknown Speaker 37:41
his name was Prince Ames before he became King James I had its mother beheaded.

Unknown Speaker 37:48
But they’re mad, they get mad at me. And then that

Unknown Speaker 37:51
version of the Bible,

Unknown Speaker 37:52
they start to talk about his version. As soon as they start to talk about homosexuality, he’s so you know, there was an uproar. I had obviously made everybody upset because they started to talk about, you know, trans women, being able to use whatever restroom that they use. And what I said to them was, it’s not my business. Bible says, Judge not lest you be judged. So they got upset. Because I said that that was above my paygrade. So what I said again, was what I let God be in Dominion of his his kingdom, and I’ve my my business. I can’t put that person in heaven or hell for what they do.

Unknown Speaker 38:45
That’s my favorite mean, it’s with God. Now. Literally. That’s what that that’s what God you and like. So these same people will tell you that the Bible is the infallible Word of God. And it’s how truthful it is. And in all of this stuff, and that God is intentional and strategic. Well, is whenever you’ve studied like, Greco Roman society, the Grecian or Roman way. You know that monogamy and heterosexuality was not common.

Unknown Speaker 39:23
And it ain’t nothing.

Unknown Speaker 39:25
But Jesus was not Yeah, it was not happenstance that his boys were from Greece and Rome. So you can’t tell me that all his whole camp was straight. So he intentionally fraternize with and it says, Those that were undesirable. So those same people that we would we would deem undesirable today, we are called as Christian believers, whatever we want to call ourselves to love, love thy neighbor as we love ourselves. So he wasn’t shunning them, and it’s not for us to shine either.

Unknown Speaker 39:58
Yeah, what I did day They they thought that they could shame me into change they learned that they are my opinion about it. And I sell my my my business on this my favorite thing to say when people go on is just keep your eyes on your own paper one batch old sin. And then I looked at the the owner of the group today I was looking at me she she’s cut her hair. Oh, her hair is dyed. For we know, we know but we know what what the Bible says about cutting your hair. So

Unknown Speaker 40:40
you How dare you cut your crown and glory.

Unknown Speaker 40:46
So like we can’t, I mean, pick it, we pick and choose what we want to ask in it in order to harm other people and it becomes up a becomes a real theory and we point

Unknown Speaker 40:55
fingers at someone else. totally ignoring and disregarding the fingers pointed back at us and hoping that nobody sees them. Get out of here with that. Okay,

Unknown Speaker 41:07
so there’s been a big thing. Derrick Jackson, his wife has finally been revealed. I’ve followed him for a number of years I followed him follow him. I don’t follow him on social media. But I do, you know, see when people post his means and stuff usually talks about relationship stuff like men don’t cheat. postings in, you know, makes videos in his car come in on other things and other people’s stuff and other people’s mess. And clearly he is he has his own mess. He’s mostly for wit now, three women have come out one woman was said she was pregnant. For all of a sudden he just started posting his wife, we’d never even know he was married. But that was also none of my business. And I guess since this has all come out, now the wife is under scrutiny and I don’t want to scrutinize her. But I do find it weird. The way she is clinging so heavily to the Bible, when he this person is just a man. So, I mean, I really want to talk about like how the Bible is used for used as a mechanism of shame and control of women to keep us docile. Even even when in the in the movie, right? So if you guys didn’t see Aretha genius, it’s on hold or whatever. Um, when the wife found out that he had impregnated the 12 year old, he prayed. He prayed and was like, I need you God to remove this from me. You know, I need my wife to be pious. She’s filled with so much goodness, that I know we can sustain this. And I was just like, I don’t. I don’t know what to do with this. Because at our core belief, we want to believe that the person that we have chosen deserves a second chance. That’s what the Bible teaches us about renewal and restoration. It’s Easter time now. But not every union is is made, that God has put together

Unknown Speaker 43:22
that that’s where it starts right there. We’re quick to say, well, the Bible says what God has joined together, let no man put it away. But Paul’s swear to god join that together just because he allowed it to happen, that many join that together. But we’re never honest with ourselves enough to admit that.

Unknown Speaker 43:47
Again, the Bible is being used as, as a weapon and wielded selfishly. The Bible scripture versus prayer. Just Just looking at biblical construct, you know, and that that whole how that whole garden of Eden thing went and creation went, it was God man, woman, and, you know, God gave woman to man, but what did he give women?

Unknown Speaker 44:17
We are the original center, what?

Unknown Speaker 44:19
What, and that’s always been put off on women. But if you look at just how it all transpired, God gave the rule in order to Adam Eve was there. So we don’t know what version she got from Adam. And when the whole thing went down in the garden with the the serpent. Adam, if you look at this, if you look at the translation of the words, Adam was as close to Eve as elbow to elbow Adam was right there the entire time. Why that whole exchange was going down and didn’t say a mumbling word. And when God came to ask him about it, his first words out His map was that woman you gave me. And since then we’ve been taking the blame and having to be honest, well, no God, this is what happened. I was deceived. That’s what she said, the serpent deceived me. She and we’ve been honest about that account and covering up man’s bs since since creation. So I think it’s important that we as women learn to call bs on stuff that bs that how it played out in the reetha. BS. The How are you a relationship guru? You’re talking about black men don’t cheat and you’re following don’t even know you have a wife and you’ve been married for how long?

Unknown Speaker 45:40
They’ve been together 14 years.

Unknown Speaker 45:41
So why are you embarrassed of your wife? Why aren’t you putting her up on a pedestal? Why aren’t you complimenting her? Why aren’t you singing her praises? Ever, ever? Nobody knows. Your adoring fan and public does not know that you have Oh, you know why they don’t know that you have a wife. Because you think that if people knew that you were married, that that would that would take away your sex appeal. And you know that what you’re selling to people is sex and sex appeal. And the idea that perhaps they may can be part of your harem at this point. But know that no.

Unknown Speaker 46:20
And you know what you said a word when you say we don’t know what mantle is. Because a lot of times we are just relying on the word of a man instead of listening and reading and absorbing the Word of God for ourselves. And even when I am, in my, my role as a therapist, and counseling people who are, you know, maybe trans, may be gay, you know, maybe just straight who had really contentious and oppressive relationships with the the Bible as translated through their families or through their ministers or through their communities, I often tell them to read your Bible. Like you got to read it for yourself,

Unknown Speaker 47:14
and get a version that you understand we don’t talk in this style and the good one you understand and language that’s relevant to you. They have a gulla and giti Bible that I’m feeling a bit too heavy. Yeah, they do. They really do.

Unknown Speaker 47:28
I don’t even I can’t even imagine what that even read like Lord,

Unknown Speaker 47:33
like get what in words that you understand that not one of the ones that kind of totally twist the context or the way you totally miss the reference but but yet still in words that you understand. And that you can talk because you that’s why the Bible says to take the word and hide it in your heart. So that if you have no Bible that you have these words in your heart, so if you have to know it, in words that you can understand that you can repeat back to yourself the Lord

Unknown Speaker 48:05
what I was gonna say was my aunt she often when we have conversations, she often remarks about how I am more Christian than some of the people that she knows in the church and I was like I because I’m not there for show I’m not trying to dress up actually read my Bible

Unknown Speaker 48:21
in crisis is my kids within us if we’re creating his image, God is in us. And it all points back to him. But so that that whole thing, like I just saw, like from Latin for the season, Latin, I’ve been distancing myself from social media, and finally, just kind of deleting my page for a while. And so I’ve, but you can’t go with any circles and not hear about this. And it’s a pattern in terms of these these, for lack of a better phrase, relationship gurus, whose relationships look like trash. You know, starting kind of one of the most familiar examples and most recent ones is Steve Harvey with

Unknown Speaker 49:07
his wife’s name Mary.

Unknown Speaker 49:09
Right. Like when he couldn’t he wouldn’t forget their names, right?

Unknown Speaker 49:12
I mean, all his wives was named married pretty much. That’s all crazy. I mean, he didn’t have to change the monograms

Unknown Speaker 49:20
Oh, anything not not nothing, your initials are still the same. So you know, starting with Steve Harvey and the thing about these they’re not even necessarily honest and open about their mess and about their mess and trash. Like you know, tell me your Tell me your life and stuff is ate up. You know, that makes you much more palatable to me.

Unknown Speaker 49:42
I mean, we can look at Jamal Bryant, we go girl, what was the other one that passed away?

Unknown Speaker 49:49
Um, Eddie long.

Unknown Speaker 49:50
Um,

Unknown Speaker 49:53
but any any any man have a cough? Um, it’s still a man. Exactly, but we put them up on pedestals are one of the things in the app that that’s just the folks of color. You know, in terms of looking at

Unknown Speaker 50:10
swag swaggered I’m Jim Baker,

Unknown Speaker 50:15
Jim Baker and Tammy

Unknown Speaker 50:19
like she like her son that’s on preaches but he’s a different guy. He’s a different minister.

Unknown Speaker 50:27
Have to find him but like so in but we put them on a pedestal and on on

Unknown Speaker 50:33
recently the the, the white minister from Hillsong

Unknown Speaker 50:40
Oh, yeah, with the the picture

Unknown Speaker 50:45
he got ran out of town. He He’s from here, New York. I’m Justin Bieber’s minister. He was sleeping with somebody in his knee. Okay. Lift Oh, wow. And I don’t know I guess because growing up in the black church hearing that testimony story I you always root for the underdog you root for like a Malcolm X kind of transfer information here. And now that you know, Martin Luther King was, you know, probably have an extramarital affairs doesn’t really surprise me.

Unknown Speaker 51:23
Or I don’t you, you better not say nothing bad about Martin, actually, but

Unknown Speaker 51:27
actually refused to believe it.

Unknown Speaker 51:29
What is a?

Unknown Speaker 51:34
No cuz, you

Unknown Speaker 51:38
know, but, but it’s not a ruin. It’s just, it’s just,

Unknown Speaker 51:42
he is the man? Yes.

Unknown Speaker 51:44
Well, and you got to understand just even biblically speaking, that, that if I can capture the head of your congregation, or whatever you put on a pedestal, everything else will fall. So what gets me is that these men don’t hold themselves to a higher standard. They think it’s okay, I’m just a man. And Derek, you knew that you out here preaching this, you knew that you doing what you were doing, could ruin your street cred. And you could care less you pass to whomever you are, you knew that sleeping with your choir members, people, whoever else while you’re married doing this, and you could care less because either you thought you were above reproach, or you thought that nobody would care. But you you cared more about your faith than you did about the souls that you should be saved? Well, and so it’s just it’s just that arrogance. And, and I think like, like one of the things, I saw that that whole, they were saying, you know, narcissistic personality disorder. But I also think there’s a certain level of that, that goes with any man seeking power. Hello, she’s of leadership. And

Unknown Speaker 52:47
I think, I think I think, and I would love to have a black male therapist, if you’re listening to come on and talk about it. But I think and I’ve spoken to my own therapist about this, that in order to be a black man in America, you have to be narcissistic, in order to think that you can succeed because everything in society is telling you that you cannot do anything, you are not worth anything you are not, you know, gonna, you may not be able to live, I see a lot of black men celebrate and live until 40 or live until 50. Because they didn’t think that they you know that they defied the odds, which is defying the odds in America. But like, I think in order to really truly succeed in America, you have to kind of be narcissistic. Now, narcissistic doesn’t mean that you reach the diagnostic criteria. But personality disorder is a spectrum or personality development. It’s a spectrum. And I find that black men, men in general, but black men in particular, have to have a an over inflated, super delusional ego to believe that they can beat the odds, out of all odds, because everything in society is telling you that you won’t make it.

Unknown Speaker 54:05
I think we all do as people of color.

Unknown Speaker 54:08
I find that black women, for the most part, have a little bit more humanity.

Unknown Speaker 54:16
And humility. Yeah, upside of head against it. They beat us up.

Unknown Speaker 54:23
Because black men still have the power to make us their footstool that we have, it becomes a thing. So when I watched that video of this woman tonight, you’re sitting there defending the man who has dishonored her. Yeah, disrespected her, disregarded her and threw her to the side. defend him and not only that, then to make the V video, I don’t know if you saw the other video that she made where she said that I wasn’t worried about combing my hair, or putting on a bra because I am dressed in the full armor of Jesus and I’m going to destroy the demons who are coming into my, my household. And I’m like, Well, I mean, are you gonna start with your husband?

Unknown Speaker 55:21
How about that, hello, somebody, I want to say this, you deserve better. You deserve.

Unknown Speaker 55:27
She deserve exactly what she has.

Unknown Speaker 55:34
That I was. But But again, I think it’s, um, I think she’s been subjected to her to religious propaganda, whatever it is, whatever it is that she’s been taught growing up. Um, I think she’s just subject well

Unknown Speaker 55:51
as a grown up because there’s a there’s a thing floating around of the church that they belong in. And they are both in this dis video of them being in this church where there is a minister, there is a minister who is praying over what looks like a woman’s vagina to remove sexual demons from her. Okay, and he is exercising the oral sex demon from her and I’m watching it and I’m like, I don’t I don’t know the scripture in the Bible were like, God, what is this?

Unknown Speaker 56:31
So I’m gonna tell you what’s missing in there just biblically.

Unknown Speaker 56:34
Okay, cuz i know i’ve you know, I read it cover to cover, but I figured maybe I missed them.

Unknown Speaker 56:39
Here’s the part that I liken it to you. And this is where it occurred. To me this is just the state that kind of gotten a little backward they missing something. So so there’s the woman that they brought to be stoned right? Because she was sleeping with another man. And so you got to understand I really, I kind of dumbed down like these biblical accounts. But Jesus is playing in the sand for lack of a better phrase, he he drawn in the sand. And what they do is they bring her pretty much to him and he not really paying them any attention. And so they you know, they call him out on it. And he’s like, oh, man, she was wait. So now these fools and told off all on themselves they sit here watching this so let’s let’s say liking it so you don’t watch this point. You watching them do what they do. You don’t grab her. Well, boy, you didn’t bring Oh boy. Nobody talks about what Jesus had was writing in the sand but I’m willing to bet he was writing in the sand all their names. That’s why he could say you know what you you without saying let you pass the first Don’t you ever last one of them had to leave every last one. Because could not want anything. And I bet you almost not one couldn’t couldn’t say either. They hadn’t been with her, or one of her girls. So so you you cast and stuff out of out of her out of this woman. But you’re not calling nothing about the man. The demons that are visiting her? Are you serious? Because I’m willing to bet if the reason she couldn’t say you know whose name it was because it might have been somebody up in that congregation when he was when he was saying, you know, what’s his name? What’s his name? No. No, they got that all twisted, you blaming the woman with with the demon we used to do that put his penis in her mouth. And oh, yeah, I wanted to throw my phone when I looked at that. And I’ve seen this a couple of times, like you, you are kidding me?

Unknown Speaker 58:38
Well, he’s not the only minister that I’ve seen do that. But just to see.

Unknown Speaker 58:43
And it’s always the women. It’s never the men. I don’t see them. I don’t see them dipping no males penis and no holy water. I’ve yet to see that happen.

Unknown Speaker 58:53
I don’t know that. I want to see. I don’t want that’s not a baptism.

Unknown Speaker 58:57
I’m looking forward to just let us know. You will do all these inappropriate acts with us as women. But you will never imitate the same on that ever. You’re touching our wounds but not touching their area. Not that you’re not touching their mouth, their eyes, none of that. Their hands nothing. When you look at porn, when you look at indecency, when you look at adultery, nothing. But you’re taking all these acts with us.

Unknown Speaker 59:24
So China MacLean posted a video recently where she talks about all of the acts in the Bible, and all of the actors so she talks about, you know, rehab, Apostle Paul, Abraham, all their sayings can King David as she lists them, King Solomon all of the dirty deeds that they have done that’s documented in the Bible.

Unknown Speaker 59:48
Nine

Unknown Speaker 59:50
and people are just like it to me. You got to read the entire Bible for yourself. Like as a Christian, that’s supposed to be your goal. Read it, study it, go to church on Sunday, right?

Unknown Speaker 1:00:08
Well, not necessarily. You don’t

Unknown Speaker 1:00:10
need nonetheless what really but you don’t really need anybody to interpret the word for you, right? You got to read it to take away from it what you what what is beneficial for you,

Unknown Speaker 1:00:23
like God can talk to you just like he can talk to anybody else. He’s not a respecter of person, or education or literacy level for that matter.

Unknown Speaker 1:00:36
I just think that this whole bastardization of biblical principles in order to I want to say castigate you’re not as Sunday, I’m some to make women feel horrible about the deeds of their their husbands is just a bad thing. And it reminded me of a friend that I have. He was cheating repeatedly on his wife, he would say certain things that would erode her confidence in front of me. He say stuff like because everybody calls me banks. He be like, looking at how Banks got her hair done. Sean, you should have your hair like that. Or look at how she looked at her shoes. She’s so fashionable, do you see a range? And I had to pull him aside and be like, stop that. That is your wife. Number one, you and I are just friends. Number two, I don’t ever want anybody to feel any kind of way that they don’t need to feel. And then I saw point. He he didn’t stop. So I had to go to her. And I said, Why do you let him do that to you? And she said, Well, I don’t really pay him no real attention. And I was like, he got hurt. I’m a woman that has to hurt. He wouldn’t stop doing what he was doing. I told him you need to stop doing what he was doing. Well, I guess it was just one last straw.

Unknown Speaker 1:01:58
And I guess she

Unknown Speaker 1:01:59
wants to found out something that he was doing. And since her like a psychotic break, break down. She was spouting the Bible that God told her will reveal to her what was going on. You know, he told her to, you know, kill her. Like she really tried to stop the life out of this man. And she ended up in the psych ward. And I told him I was like, I told you that not only were you pushing her over the edge, but y’all rely on religion to control this thing. And look what you have. Now. He’s like, my, my wife was gone. Like it was he said, her eyes completely changed. She turned into something else before him. And I was he was like, she looked possessed. And I was like, I don’t that’s above my paygrade to say that she was But no, I told her she was gonna get tired.

Unknown Speaker 1:03:06
I told you that. All I could do was listen to him and say because it didn’t make sense in the moment to say I told you so.

Unknown Speaker 1:03:16
Right.

Unknown Speaker 1:03:19
But I just said to him, I hope now you don’t. I hope now you finish.

Unknown Speaker 1:03:26
What was it in him? And I was

Unknown Speaker 1:03:29
stuck by him to everything. Everything stuck by him to everything. Like anything that America suffer. She stood by him. And I used to ask him Aren’t you tired? Like you got to see she deserves better than this. But she when I tell you she snapped she’s almost like what like a weak FC her now will speak to her now you think nothing ever happened to you back to her old self they still together? I don’t know if he has changed.

Unknown Speaker 1:04:14
Why though. Why, but this was before I

Unknown Speaker 1:04:17
do what I do for a living now. So I always I know that they were that there is sickness in that midst, and it was you know, she’s surprisingly the same one of the

Unknown Speaker 1:04:30
two, huh?

Unknown Speaker 1:04:32
But what do you what do you think about like, the use of like demonology. And like this, this terminology as it relates to mental illness, because I also watched creflo dollar one time, and he was saying how he used to work in a mental institution and there was a schizophrenic that nobody could reach and the medication wasn’t working and therapy wasn’t working and nothing was working. But he prayed with the person Then, and then the person just got better. Now I don’t. I know that prayer works. But I know my Bible also tells me fake without works is dead. So you got to actually do something in order to get better. And there’s a science behind, you know, therapeutics is and so I cringed a little when I heard it not not denying his his experience of it. But I know that for others in the church, sometimes you’re just told to pray away mental health issues and not actually seek a qualified Cosmo with clinical skills.

Unknown Speaker 1:05:42
I think I go I to stand on faith without works is dead. And there are things that have to be worked out, I think. I think we have to decide if the Bible speaks of demons and possessions, and we can’t discount that. And I say that from the standpoint of, we can’t say that this this doesn’t exist in one venue and then say that it does in the other. And I speak that we can’t say that ghosts don’t exist, but we believe in the Holy Spirit. Like, we can’t we can’t say that or expect to do with where it says greater works in these will we do are we expected to do and we don’t, we don’t count that no, there were the casting out of demons and such. But I also think that, um, so many people perish, because they don’t get the professional treatment, and assistance and the medications that can help. And we don’t think we understand or that we treat, we treat it as like a one size fits all. And that’s not it at all.

Unknown Speaker 1:06:59
I also find that a lot of my clients who are schizophrenic some of their I will say delusions, which is kind of like the their mind set and their thoughts. Also on religion as well. I had one woman said she was she was married, she was pregnant with Jesus. Like that. I’ve seen some of it. Like a large percentage of it be biblical, in it more or religious in a sense.

Unknown Speaker 1:07:37
And that one wouldn’t surprise me one bit. Because you got to also think like doing biblical times, even our religion was thought to be cultic what we what Christians are now was thought to be coated and thought to be a cult. Even even the practicing or what they consider witchcraft

Unknown Speaker 1:07:58
on some toes.

Unknown Speaker 1:08:01
So you said that you you can’t say that you believe one but not the other. Yeah. Right. So also in this group, they talked about going to fortune tellers. Yet the Bible speaks of prophets all the time,

Unknown Speaker 1:08:19
like the like the prophet Isaiah prophet that would talk about, you know, the seven years of fees to seven years ago and

Unknown Speaker 1:08:26
on, but what’s the difference? What’s the difference? Because they they posted in this group of men again, about how one woman she says, she’s Christian, she was on this, she’s a talk show host, she was on the show. She, you know, they had a person there, she didn’t seek the person, the person was just there. She went to work. And that’s what they were doing that day. And they offered a reading and the stuff that they said to her rang true. There was somebody who passed away in her family, I think it was a medium, and then everybody in the group were up in arms, and they were like, Oh, this is you know, that will work and stuff. And I’m like, but the leader of this group calls herself a prophet, and she tells you how to future all the time. I’m very confused, like so we, we if you call yourself a prophet, we could believe you. But if it’s not in the church, I can’t believe it. And so I had a situation where you know, me being Western in a friend of mine went to get a reading I went with her, you know, the person had had a message for my mother it was health wise or whatever and I was, I told my friend I was like, I don’t even know how to even present this to my mother cuz you know, we black, black, black from down south, and like, you know, rule and people to root on yeah and like i don’t really know how to like do this and i had to have a conversation with my mom and i was like well i know that when we went to church as a family i don’t remember any profits coming to our church but was there any profits that used to come to the church and my mother was like yeah there was this lady she was to come in i was like what did what she’s saying was it true like did it come true is that and she was like yeah some of it you don’t want to and i was like okay well can i went to something similar and they had a message for you do you want me tell you and she was like you tell me what it was and so i told her and i was like what they told me that you should you know get this checked out of your body this is what they see or whatever and she was like okay yeah and that was like cleaning the but i had to figure out how to present it in a way that wasn’t going to be reject it because i don’t get to choose god’s messenger

Unknown Speaker 1:11:00
right why none of us do if he can use any and everything he darn sure can use a rock to talk to me or tree

Unknown Speaker 1:11:12
well i never heard no tree yet but

Unknown Speaker 1:11:15
you can you can see a message in the leaves you know he very well can you somebody else to speak to me if he’ll use anything in any and you know what he can use the same and the unsaved like to speak to me to get a message through because sometimes i might not listen to those to whom i should have asked you know what he’d like so for me for me he uses music like music ministers to me gosh me too and it’ll be a song it’ll be some some song i hadn’t heard in years or it’ll be a string of songs coming on that and this could be on like the hip hop station that will have me boo hooing or you know just speak to me in ways that maybe i wouldn’t catch in any other way so but but you least you had the discernment to know that hey you know what i need to figure out how to how to make this palatable how to present this to my mom just saying to her that this second woman says she had a word for her might not get through

Unknown Speaker 1:12:28
well the person knew way too many things that were true yeah so i didn’t i didn’t you know if someone is telling me that something could possibly harm my mother i gotta tell her but it like i gotta say it in the way she will listen i gotta you know pack this in a religious form that she could understand because i can’t just say that we you know with my west indian friend we went to the obeah man this is what he said like what and i’m simply along for the ride and he’s telling me stuff about my mother and my father and my like he knows stuff that he could possibly no job just sitting there

Unknown Speaker 1:13:20
boy i had no idea you’d become in you can’t say well mama chicken george with the chicken foot said to do this and do that so i don’t i don’t i don’t know

Unknown Speaker 1:13:32
the bible

Unknown Speaker 1:13:33
but i love looking at the biblical tenets of what we consider voodoo and witchcraft and like there was a reason that the gift hello baby jesus are you reading it like you read all my kids

Unknown Speaker 1:13:49
to read in my mind because i was literally about to say that in that group that i am in they talk about people burning sage or an unsaved burning burning frankenfoods all of these things and i’m like i and my grandmother’s bible in the back of the bible is in this herbes that she got the big old bible with white jesus on the cover is the bible she left me in the back of the bible it just has nothing but arbs

Unknown Speaker 1:14:21
yep that’s what that’s what route working is working is understanding mother nature understanding mother or understanding the healing properties of what what god that’s why god gave me a dominion over the earth like if that’s what that’s really what root working is yep and understanding like the poisonous nature and and and how root can control people and influence folks like you got to be kidding me folks you know they threw water on us

Unknown Speaker 1:14:57
yeah i don’t know if these people read they buy

Unknown Speaker 1:15:00
And Christianity did not start with slavery. That was not the first introduction of Africans, if you will, to Christianity. Like that was not it? It didn’t it didn’t start here like that. The reason they threw water on us when we got to shouting and dancing and employees and while we were in slayed, because they didn’t understand our praise, they didn’t understand our worship, and it’s still the same today. But now we don’t understand it.

Unknown Speaker 1:15:29
Because it’s been dilute, it’s been

Unknown Speaker 1:15:32
and and we don’t get it. You are right about that. We think that Christianity and God is just, it’s just all male. No, no, no. Because the Bible talks about wisdom, her wisdom she, like it didn’t need to know. But yeah, that’s another story for another day. I think, I think, I think we forget that we were created to worship. And so we find ourselves worshiping different entities and deities and, and celebrity statuses. And putting these folks up on pedestals. The fact that the majority of relationship advice for women come from men pay to amples. Me, this really, really baffles me. And come from men without a habit of successful relationships come from men who would be the type of men we wouldn’t desire. Oh, and also, but primarily the type of men that we tend to date. And it just, it just baffles me, but we date what we see, I had absolutely just blows my mind. And the fact that we women, attack Derek’s wife, before attacking him. We attack what she had or what she looked like that I listed that I’ve seen.

Unknown Speaker 1:16:57
That was to me that was more so about him. She was no surprise to me. Because the personality makeup that he has about himself, you know, doing what I do for a living without diagnosing him. He is no different than the wives that I see. A lot of my friends have, oh, yeah, who all sleep around, who all have extramarital affairs and they have some, but he is she she was no different then that it is like a max. I mean, when he and I would talk about relationships, and he was religious. And he was in the church. And I’m like, I don’t want to be your I’ll be your your wife and your girlfriend. And he was like, that’ll never be happening. And I’m like, how? Why? Because a lot of men had this kind of like Madonna whore complex,

Unknown Speaker 1:17:50
right? Yeah. Well, we

Unknown Speaker 1:17:51
were let’s just call it Mary and Mary. Hello, Mary Mary comics. Because one was the mother of Christ was prostitute. And so a lot of men have this fantasy that if this woman is going to be the mother of my child, she must be purer than the driven snow. So when I saw the wife, you know, in the in the head, I didn’t it wasn’t a bond. It was a hat. I thought it was a hat. And but you know, they’ll make up No, no, nothing. And, I mean, just she didn’t have a bra, but I haven’t had a bra on at months because we’ve been working from home, but just it it startled me. Not for her. I was embarrassed for her. But he’s so image conscious. That it sitting right next to him. It just looked askew.

Unknown Speaker 1:18:52
It looked off.

Unknown Speaker 1:18:57
A tangent, so they Derek, Derek, what do you overcompensating for?

Unknown Speaker 1:19:04
Well, like I said, if you show me who your wife is, I’ll show you who you are.

Unknown Speaker 1:19:10
What are you overcompensating for with all this? This body consciousness you got going on? What what what? What are you trying to make up for?

Unknown Speaker 1:19:23
I find that in marriages the wife that a man chooses the Bible says he who finds a wife so he’s doing the finding. It says a lot about the relationship dynamic and it shows a lot about that man’s personality so once I did finally did see the life outside of her wedding day cuz she was absolutely beautiful. You look at her, there are pictures where she she can dress up she you know, I as long as natural as you’ve got all of the things that we could she could take a clean up. But the fact that that’s not the image that she portrays. It says about who he is to me.

Unknown Speaker 1:20:03
Again, how long y’all been married? And why we just not hearing about your wife?

Unknown Speaker 1:20:07
How can people make a greater spiritual investment to be closer to godliness? In the midst of all of this? Garbage?

Unknown Speaker 1:20:21
So there are only 24 hours in the day? What are you putting in? What are you taking in? What are you absorbing in that 24 hours a day? Where are you spending your time? How are you beginning your day? How are you ending your day? You know, what, what are you feeding on throughout the day? I mean, and that’s from the standpoint of meditation from the standpoint of media exposure, you know, kind of what goes into is what comes out of you. So, I think that’s how I think that’s where it starts. You know, if you are spending the bulk of your time on social media, then then how are you fostering your relationship with whatever religious deity that you profess? Or how you just how are you bettering yourself? How are you investing in yourself and your well being and your wellness? For me, I’ve had to find that, you know, starting my day off, we’ve been doing like this, this prayer challenge with a group of folks. We start off, I think, right now we’re at like, seven o’clock till 630 in the morning, Eastern time. And for the folks on the west coast. That’s 330 in the morning, Eastern time. Oh, man, where are we? We were just we just ended a 10 day says yesterday was midnight today, where we gradually went, you know, we were doing only fruits and vegetables after a certain time, you know, fasting and just kind of like, What are you? What are you surrounding yourself with? And so for me, I have to surround myself with folks that are going to pour into me folks that are going to build me up folks that are going to challenge me it’s kind of that same notion. If you are the smartest person in your circle, you need a better circle. You know, so what what are you are you like, you’re not going to grow closer to God or whoever if you’re not spending time with him or her or in the word. If you’re not meditating, if you’re not journaling, if you’re not reflecting you have to be intentional about it. And if you’re not surrounding yourself with people who are going to encourage you to be better, and encourage you and lift you up when you’re struggling. This iron sharpens iron. Yeah, I

Unknown Speaker 1:22:34
remember my mother, I was praying for something. And you know, I was telling my mother like I was really struggling spiritually. At one point, my mother said, Well, what

Unknown Speaker 1:22:44
are you putting in? Huh? So which means she’s like, Well, you know, you you call it on God to give you something but what did you invest? Like, what did you What do you invest in in your relationship with God’s even ask for anything? And I was like,

Unknown Speaker 1:23:05
and so, you know, I think for me, I lean a lot more. A lot. Looking at scrolling YouTube says Steve Harvey’s wife inside chicks. Jesus be a fence.

Unknown Speaker 1:23:19
Wait, so what the interesting story is this story about Marjorie as a whole when you look at Marjorie’s path.

Unknown Speaker 1:23:26
This got to be old stuff. Just got to all get here. Yeah. Listen, but But listen, nobody, hello, she got the passable passes, because, you know, well, I said pass pa ss, but you know, pass to the show. Um, but nobody ever talks about it. And it is what it is. So I’m not I’m never I’m never gonna be mad at a woman being restored. Because men are restored every day,

Unknown Speaker 1:23:53
every day.

Unknown Speaker 1:23:56
So I’m never gonna be be upset about a woman being restored. And let’s hope you know, Derrick Jackson’s wife will be restored. You know, let’s hope that’s hope that that for all of us, you know what I mean? They we are able to like think about the things that we need in life in the end to sacrifice for it. Sometimes sacrificing is not just leaving that marriage. It’s kind of leaving behind it. It all. Yeah. And so I was saying something else, but I lost my train of thought, when Steve Harvey foolishness came up on YouTube. But I’m

Unknown Speaker 1:24:29
your mom was talking about what are you investing? What are you investing in?

Unknown Speaker 1:24:32
Yeah, I mean, we, I speak to a lot to clients who are struggling with religiosity and really wanting to connect spiritually. Because there is something you know, no matter you know, I’m about science and but nothing has been able to scientifically explain why I wake up in the morning. You know what I mean, and why sometimes You just die in your sleep of natural causes. Nothing has been able to explain that. So obviously there are there are things that we just don’t understand they are there, there are percentages of our brains that we don’t even know what it does. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 1:25:15
huge percentage of it. I love neuroscience and how our brain works. And what part of the brain controls what, in terms of our body and just our emotions in life.

Unknown Speaker 1:25:31
You know, we are spiritual beings in a physical form. And so for me, trying to strike that balance, to be able to invest in spirituality with healthy religious principles is something that I wrestle with all the time, especially being that my religious Foundation was unhealthy. It was so toxic, I think this idea of like toxic you know, religion and I had a client recently whose whose mother was sick. And that’s what he she said, she said, My mother used to pray for eight hours a day and never take care of me. Wow, she’s like, I don’t know what her diagnosis was. I don’t know what her issue was, but she used the term is toxic Christianity. And I was like that that is a word.

Unknown Speaker 1:26:21
Yeah. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 1:26:29
I think it’s a matter of focusing on those things that bring us healing those things that that are our light and joy and love in our life those things and those people those things that build us up back those things that beat us up or beat us down I’m probably one of the the weirdest things to see at a gas station. With listening to country music singing along knowing the words you would never expect this this black chick is going to be who gets out the car with the Country Music pumping while we invented it, but but like much it’s been appropriated and taken over by the others, the folks that looks like the inside of our hand. And but the reason I listened to that aloud is I don’t have to worry about turning it down when kids are around I don’t have to worry about it be attacking me. Like you know I’m not being called out of my name or being made to feel lesser than at something that it said but I’m also the same one that’s going to know all the words to stop by UGK or to park or Biggie like I’m also that same person so it’s but it’s it’s giving yourself what you need in the time that you need it you know sometime that that may be the that may be your your Sunday gospel soundtrack. Other times it may be my ratchet music but giving yourself what you need and being honest with yourself about what if something is either either adding to your life or subtracting from it so just really being honest something or someone

Unknown Speaker 1:28:16
Yeah, cuz that my gosh, after watching Aretha I’m like, I definitely want to download that. The Amazing Grace out

Unknown Speaker 1:28:25
Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 1:28:27
like, Oh, I didn’t even know about this album is the best selling out, you know, gospel album of all time how.

Unknown Speaker 1:28:36
So my mom and I we watched her retargets last week we were for whatever it first started. And when they were playing it kind of back to back to back. And I the roles that the roles my mom born and raised in Harlem, but Rose is the song that I fell in love with Rita by just because of how he spoke to the brokenness of women and how you’re still a rose regardless and that we like you know that that was like a self esteem boost to me and I probably was a teenager when that came out. or young adult but that that that boosts that’s what made me fall in love with Riri and how she spoke to women. You know, never mind all of this. You are better than that. Yeah. And no matter what you’ve been through, you don’t look like what you’ve been through.

Unknown Speaker 1:29:20
But as I change from jump, because I listened to jump as a grown up and I’m like, wait a minute when my baby called, jumped to it hold up. And then to know that she wasn’t even she was married to Glenn terman at the time, who most of us know from a different world. But she was married to him at the time and then she won’t go home. She won’t pay no mind but yeah, jumped to it is the is the song that made it to me. And that’s because Luther Vandross, who also was from Harvard. He wrote that so yeah, but yeah, I’m like I want to download the album. Not so much about Aretha love it But I’m what I’ve learned to love Aretha as a grown up. But you know, I grew up in a Christian home. So we listened to James Cleveland all the time.

Unknown Speaker 1:30:10
So what you don’t if you want to ruin your childhood? No,

Unknown Speaker 1:30:13
no, no, don’t tell me.

Unknown Speaker 1:30:15
No, no.

Unknown Speaker 1:30:18
I don’t want to know, go back and look up the history behind a lot of the folks that we’ve add alive. And I know

Unknown Speaker 1:30:25
that these people are just people, I know that they’re just people.

Unknown Speaker 1:30:30
You want to ruin your child, that

Unknown Speaker 1:30:33
I have had a client recently, and there was some family, you know, things that were discovered in, they were just trying to like, figure out how they were going to tell the children, you know, how we break the news that so and so and so and so. And I was like, Listen, do you sit those kids down and you tell them you know, what grown up relationships are complicated? And she was like, well, that’s so simple. And I was like, Yeah, but it’s the truth. Like we get older. We also we are so into like putting our family Mom, Dad, you know, whoever up on a pedestal that you realize these people are just people and they struggle just like we struggle. And if you ever want to read a struggle, story, read anything in the Bible, right?

Unknown Speaker 1:31:18
Anything and everything, you know,

Unknown Speaker 1:31:21
cuz even Jesus who died on the cross, he still struggled with his faith. It was a moment.

Unknown Speaker 1:31:29
Yeah, but he did. And he know the end, and the beginning and still struggle, come on somebody.

Unknown Speaker 1:31:38
So I think that we have to really start reading our Bible and not just getting the information secondhand. And really start seeing like, you know, what is being revealed. To us it’s in sometimes for me, just kind of like the strength of my intuition, that when when the Lord will leave me I know when God is speaking to me was when he won’t leave me alone.

Unknown Speaker 1:32:03
The best way to hide something from somebody is to put it in a book

Unknown Speaker 1:32:07
lab, the wrong somebody because I read books,

Unknown Speaker 1:32:10
as well as you should, and everyone should read and read the Good Book at that. And there’s a plethora of resources at our fingertips, you know, hey, okay, so what was the context of this? When they talk about why women shouldn’t talk in the church or preacher, whatever? What was the context context behind that? So that you fully understand why they’re saying that? And then let’s go into the New Testament and understand where is this? Where is this proven, or disproven? Because there’s there was that by happenstance that Jesus chose to reveal himself and that he had risen to two women to spread the gospel to a host of women to spread the gospel, were meant to spread the gospel. That’s why he did that. But you know, read, read, read, yeah, the Bible for yourself. And research, research, okay, understand the context, and understand the background. Understand, like, if you want to understand who Jesus is, folks were, there were men and women, it wasn’t just that the disciples, you know, they are the major ones that we know about, but understand who was boys and who the women were, and what their character and backgrounds were, and why he was surrounded by a whole bunch of different people. Why there was the texture and the fishermen and, and what it really meant to be a carpenter and just read and study, please. And just pray, pray, meditate, right journal, whatever it is. Yeah, do it.

Unknown Speaker 1:33:34
Yeah. And I tell my clients all the time when they are dealing with this kind of stuff. And now I say, and I look at my relationship with my therapist, as my relationship with God is personal. And it’s just between me and him. And so you got to remove your family, remove your friends, move your culture, remove all of these other ideals that you have from in from being obstacles to your spiritual walk, your walk of faith, and just be with God.

Unknown Speaker 1:34:10
Look at Matt, though, just an aside, if you’re a therapist and have a therapist, you need another therapist. Because we can’t be out here being therapist and we’re not practicing what we preach him. You need another therapist, I love that you shared about talking to your therapist, I think probably says, you know, this year I was speaking with minds every week. And I was intentional and the type of therapist that I chose but if your therapy if your therapist didn’t believe in in therapists and therapy, and then have a therapist and keep it moving, yeah.

Unknown Speaker 1:34:45
It was great to catch up with you.

Unknown Speaker 1:34:48
Pleasure was all mine. Thank you for the opportunity.

Unknown Speaker 1:34:51
Oh, are you accepting clients are you busy as everybody else? What what what are you doing?

Unknown Speaker 1:34:56
I am accepting clients Under chaplaincy services and consulting everyone’s virtual I do not accept insurance everyone’s self pay let you haggle it out with your insurance folks. But my profile is on Psychology Today

Unknown Speaker 1:35:15
and telling me her name again.

Unknown Speaker 1:35:17
Oh, so I am Dr. Juanita Warren Wilson is actually my whole name

Unknown Speaker 1:35:22
okay. And um, where can they find you besides Psychology Today is that it was like a website or something.

Unknown Speaker 1:35:30
I’m a web page just short and sweet because that I believe in that for right now chaplaincy services that knit. So chaplain is ch A p as in Paul l. i n services dotnet. Once again, we

Unknown Speaker 1:35:47
want to thank Dr. Juanita Warren for coming on the show and make sure you doing whatever you need to do this week to invest in both your spiritual and mental health and guys be well thank you guys for listening to another episode of black therapists podcast once again you can follow us on all our social media sites at Black therapists podcast on Instagram and on Twitter as well as black in therapy on Facebook or you can follow your host me Miss m f ni k i think on Instagram and Twitter as well as you can find out any information about me at Nikita in ik iita Bank calm and on the show’s website lack therapists podcast calm and don’t forget if you want to send us any general feedback, show suggestions, show topics for get ideas please feel free to drop us an email at Black therapist [email protected] Thank you be well

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

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